Sosa

Hotline Miami and the Hit Sequel™ Hotline Miami 2: Wrong Number

dogg how did you miss the giant "STAFF COMPLAINTS" subforum and come to off topic for this

Yes, thank you, please edit it and please delete my second reply alongside this one - I don't want to harp/drag on or dilute the complaint with unnecessary info. Yes, you can make it public.

I was unable to edit the post but attempted to remove the second paragraph as it's unnecessary/superfluous, please disregard it.

I believe it was round #32221 on Lizard. I didn't think I'd need to detail how unfair it is to allow for an entire locker's worth of contents to be on one's person - both HoS and captain immediately ran onto cargo shuttle and started "looking for the nukie ship to nuke it" while not 1 of the Nukies were dead yet and still actively slaughtering the station. Roundstalling aside, as I'm sure they were eventually talked to, a blatant excusing of bug exploits, even if there is a PR up to fix them, at the very least is disconcerting.

That's all. Thank you to the volunteers, contributors, admins, and the players in the community for an engaging time. Just wanted to shoutout devs because this shit fucking rocks.

I am gonna say this now, if gunbolts are an issue, just wait til they figure out surgery

Gunbolts fucking rock and it's a genuine 100% skill issue if you cannot learn how to use them in 5 minutes. You can take our your Cobra, press the bolt and make an audible gun sound without having to arbitrarily cycle a round and say "Any last words?" before killing someone. Genuinely game-changing in terms of antag RP, but this fits in with other shooters where you need to rack a round after fully emptying a clip, this usually extends animations slightly - but that extra second can be the difference between life or death. It's no different here.

I have to agree that events need to be properly telegraphed if they're to be enjoyed. Knowing a round is on Extended, for instance, lets me curb any expectation of a fair fight or that I'll have any natural emergent roleplaying happening. I do wish that moments with key targets, such as Ian being made into a giant golden sun - therefore effectively disabling him or making him as an objective infinitely harder - were also telegraphed properly and treated with the same cadence, like events, but some rounds I just have to expect a giant GIF of a cat or whatever on the ground to have to work around.

actually if you look at the settings we are sprinting by default

Can we get a 3 week in update, Chief?

I'd really like this question answered if possible. I was just messaged by an admin for "powergaming every round" on my first round of the day for grabbing maintenance materials for cargo to give to the crew, essentially souring my mood toward the shift and ultimately ending it prematurely because, frankly, I'd prefer to not have to tiptoe around rewarding map knowledge because one admin is on vs another. As per the rules, there is *no* depiction of this as an issue. Especially on Box station where there is a multitude of materials lying throughout maintenance.

I'd prefer it if maintainers/devs were actively binging on hard drugs with my Pateron money and would give more if I knew this were the case. For anyone on the fence, if you have the money, you should donate because it's your favorite game, not because you can bypass a queue.

You cannot blame players for how the job is designed, I completely agree. You also cannot punish them for how it's designed. There's also not really any counter-arguments to them being a powerful force on the station because that firepower and expertise is necessary sometimes. Salvager weaponry and utilities are not locked behind a warden who is dead or SSD. You want to change how powerful salvagers are? Up the ante for Security (who got hardsuit buffs, btw.) Why can salvagers do the same things paramedics can do? Because literally anybody can. Why can we fix walls? Because literally anybody can. What you're saying are "salvager specific issues" are just game issues. You can literally take a space pen, go out to a debris as a cargo tech, find a salv suit (especially if you know the debris well,) and from there on forward you are in a 50% piercing resist suit. You can then find meds, materials, and just walk around repairing things, healing people, or doing any of the examples above. And I reiterate my point that wasn't refuted that engineers have similar, if not more dangerous, access. A silly knife (that you can get from maints loot, or get chef to make you a not as good one - alternatively find a butcher's cleaver) and a PKA (that you can just hack into salv and pick up anyway that is arguably a bust during combat if the opponent has literally *any* other ranged weapon) are perks to a job that is inherently more dangerous (fighting aliens.) The only issue is how powerful a specific role is..? In a game with fleshed out and pixel movement combat? When expeditions and debris are being worked on? That... Yeah, I mean the power values/limitations for community members are all over the place, this is definitely a great example. Having a silly knife and PKA are literally no different than being able to toggle an APC trapping you in virology while I beat you to death with a toolbox. I reiterate that you can spawn a weapon into your hand at any moment as a Syndicate and that the notion of making any role (even atmos) have less TC is bizarre, but I digress. Simple gameplay loop. Go on mission/debris -> kill space fauna -> come back with dope shit. It's literally the only 'dungeon crawling' esque job that's available and I genuinely don't see a reason to attempt to nerf the most fun jobs on the station because they are too strong. Forgive me for my power level, I know not what I do. I am a simple Salvage Specialist born before 1994 all I know is eat Cheese Honks and hack door without insuls.

What are you referencing?

People don't, or at least I don't, play salvager because it's easy syndie. Anything is easy Syndie. You can literally teleport a machine pistol into your hands and then buy over 100 bullets for it while wearing a web vest that doesn't slow you down and soaks 70% damage - as you are high on stimulants yelling at your assist objective to loot HoP's ID while your pet carp is munching on captain's dead body. External access and a knife are just perks that go both ways. Rolling syndicate engineer is arguably easier because you can just toggle an APC and entrap or murder people at whim *and* you are okay in spaces you are definitely not supposed to be in just because "oh fuck the power's off let me help" while also spawning in with engineering goggles and insulated gloves. And let me tell you - those are WAY more dangerous than a knife and a PKA. However, it doesn't take a lot of creativity to make other roles as Syndicate work. Scientist? Mass spawn anomalies until one is in your objective's workplace. Janitor? Wait until there's a mess in your objective's workplace. Passenger? I'm lost, can I come into your objective's workplace? You can spawn in as a monkey and play a Syndicate role well given enough time and patience. There are a few great points. I've long since thought access should be required when accepting, or even placing, high value orders. I, as a Cargo Technician, should not be able to order 3 crates of SMGs, 2 crates of Medical supplies and MRE's to last me an entire nuclear Winter. Requiring access for at least *the placing of the order* for these items should not only be barred via ID, but LOGGED via ID, then literally anybody in cargo can do whatever because they'd either have needed HoS access or HoS is aware of the order having been placed. Salvage Specialist is an extremely rewarding role because it is mechanic focused, this suits a certain niche of gameplay that is partly hermit roleplay and rewarding memorization of multiple skillsets, reaction time and cognitive abilities. We get to heal fellow new salvagers by using medical knowledge, aim true like William Tell and murder space ticks before they terrorize the station, we get to build a shuttle and fly it to derelict bits of stations or chase a Lone Operative. It provides roleplay about essentially a station-dweller that goes on dangerous external missions - a gritty character who comes back to grab smokes/a drink/a bite to eat and talk to the "locals" while still maintaining a grumpy, but not outright hostile, attitude because, well, bleeding to near-death from bear swipes and carp bites puts a chip on your shoulder. We get to defend Security from external threats every single round while simultaneously assisting the entire station via much needed materials (plastic, anyone?) funds and unobtainable valuables - microstims, exosuits, laser rifles, literal gravity generators, the usual. Nukies have not just SecOff to fear, but the inevitable influx of bloodthirsty pseudo-Cargonians banding together at the foaming mouths. Donning a bloodred with expedition weaponry is almost suicide nowadays - blowing through armory means nothing when 3 salvagers armed with Deathsquad weaponry come rolling up in a shuttle specifically designed with open bays to throw things in/out of (shuttle parts, materials, bullets.) While I initially saw your point and felt that it might need to be retouched since the Syndicate 10TC enabling, I think you underestimate the amount of pure power that access has. Engineers, paramedics, cargo techs, salvagers, secoffs, all heads, external access is everywhere - just gotta look. Calling something "untethered powergaming" because it's not your playstyle is a bit of a reach, I don't call people "shameless validhunters" for rolling Security or "wall paint drying enthusiasts" for rolling Engineer. There should be a mutual respect to how many times Salvagers have helped out with Nukies - as well as blood reds in general raiding armory, shit, almost forgot Rat Kings, zombies, fellow Syndies, back when Space Dragons existed, helping engineers with repairs... etc,etc.;

me when viper has a full auto mode

I also must add vehemently that I took part in Sand Wars the other day in MRP and played Obi-Wan McUrist or something like that, and I have to really wonder if someone who was solely invested in being an antagonist and no other part of the game would sit there and improv/roleplay a fucking re-enactment of Star Wars Episode III: Revenge Of The Sith where we replaced "The Force" with "Sand." I am at a genuine loss as to how someone could simultaneously be antagonist rolling and roleplaying a Force-user when I could have easily attempted to Join the current round for a Syndie roll and /ghosted if, in fact, I was fishing for antag.

I cannot seem to edit the post but would like to rephrase it, as this is a unique scenario I'd like to leave more open-ended. Please disregard the question about salvage specialists specifically and broaden it to "non-passenger roles" and if they are allowed/offered the map "goodies" strewn throughout.

How long is one expected to play in a round before they are given leeway to abandon their role? Furthermore, are passengers held to higher or lesser standards in terms of leaving their roles mid-way through round? Are they expected to stay passengers, never ghost, and play the round out every single round? Is suiciding/ghosting after 5 minutes in and of itself antag rolling, or only when it's done in excess? Is there a limitation/quantifiable model for "antag rolling" or is it solely at the discretion of the observing admin?

And how would one be considered a "powergamer" as an antagonist? Is a salvage specialist going for insuls on maps powergaming, should I just ask engineering? I figured it was fair game. Are there any specific incidents/examples that could be used as a model for "powergaming as an antagonist" to spare future antagonist player issues?

SS14 account username: Sosa Ban reason: "soft antag rolling," powergaming, being rude in OOC Date of ban: 5/14/2023 Length of ban: 3 days Events leading to the ban: I was eating dinner and SSD by the shittle building spot, but still trying to hit debris now and again and was actually just sitting down to start building a shittle on Fland. I play pretty consistently and play salvage specialist literally the same way I always do - grab debris, bring it into salvage bay. It's almost mind numbingly egregious how simple my gameplay loop is. Not only that, I make it a point to *not* antag roll specifically so that I never got into this situation, and if I'm bored as a scientist or a passenger I'll still take monkey roles and whatnot. I can't recall the last time I /ghosted roundstart, even as a passenger, but I can admit that there are times as passenger when after 20-30 minutes of nothing happening, I will stare at a wall and maybe watch YouTube. There are times where I will play until I just fall asleep or end up otherwise pre-occupied. Guarantee it happens to literally everybody, I just play this game primarily. Not ahelped, not BWOINKED, straight up banned with no communication, which definitely serves as a jump-off for another issue - this is exactly how I was banned last time. There's a severe issue with the administration being unable to communicate/inconsistent with communication and rulesets, where I am ahelped or BWOINKED from one admin I am revered by another for skillset. Where one admin has an issue with me doing exactly the same thing every round, I suppose, well, given the circumstances, another does not. I'd like a showcase of my antag rolling, if possible, and any notes leading up to this ban. I can't help but think it may have something to do with creating content that is antagonist-centric, but I digress, perhaps that's just a side-note. Lastly, speaking to people in an almost painstakingly evidently condescending manner "take a break, bud." when - Idon't know who is speaking to me/who I am speaking with (figuratively, of course, as speaking would imply both parties communicating) and I'm not friends or "buds" with anybody who fails to communicate how they feel in a civil discourse. I understand it's a euphemism, it would go a long way to treat players with respect and simply state the case as to why they're being given the punishments they're being given. Reason the ban should be removed: I don't care to have the ban removed, just like my last ban which was for stealing shoes. I just want you guys to, you know, communicate with players to curb behavior. Banning me isn't going to stop me from my playstyle because I don't know what I even did *wrong* so I genuinely don't really know how that's beneficial, as if I just come back in 3 days and do the exact same thing on accident. You can imagine my frustration at being told virtually no information and being given no recourse and simply being issued a punishment, that is actually kind of ludicrous. If you want me to take a break, just say something. I've been on vacation for a few months and start work in a few days so wouldn't even be playing as much. It's literally the only video game that I play. If it's how I communicate in OOC I can just cease communication, that's fine. I can admit that I'm crass, but try to keep things as forward as possible. The idea that there's an "unhealthy investment" is entirely subjective as I just happen to write/type extremely quickly and with tenacity - that of which I will not apologize for. I have been warned ONCE as "powergaming" as an antagonist when I was doing what I pretty much always do and solely focusing on security, this was handled in-game and in-character and I was asked how it assisted my objectives. I follow the strict sabotage rule of a 30 minute+ round going on to not ruin peoples' rounds other than murdering them for access/killing witnesses/the occasional collateral damage. I don't plasmaflood, rarely blow AME, rarely singuloose, so I genuinely fail to see how powergaming is constituted other than using the literal tools provided to me. NOT ONLY that, as an antagonist I pride myself in offering roleplay whenever I can in terms of giving people situations to go, or fear rp/terrorism RP. I'm a terrorist. That's the job. I don't understand "powergaming" in this sense. Was it buying guns as cargo? I mean, you see the issue here, right? I don't even know *what I did* lol. This is an extremely out of the blue ban given that I haven't even been ahelped for my attitude in a while (which, again, I will be the first to admit is crass but attempt to apologize for and have pretty consistently, nobody is going to be friends with everybody else in OOC, that's just not possible. If I just need to disable OOC, so be it.) and if there was an issue with my attitude, it could be communicated. I am at a genuine loss for this one and it leaves the same sour taste as getting banned for stealing fucking shoes from the chef. If you have an issue with players talk to them. If I take the game/role seriously, that's how I derive *my* fun from this video game. I work a pretty lax job, so when I get to buckle down and use 110% of my braincells, it's fun, I wouldn't ever apologize for that, and if it's an issue that I'm not taking the game in stride enough, I can't really state anything to the contrary. How someone derives fun from a video game is not up to the admin, period.

I'm gonna be real - heads being in space is literally easy AA for any Syndicate on board, I am all for giving HoP his own hardsuit to go and play in space with Ian. Jokes aside, if Nukies come, they can use EVA. Box already gives QM a fucking salv suit that has protections far beyond salvo's initial hardsuit.

There have been quite a few rounds now where bored engineers, especially atmospheric technicians who use metagame knowledge of being unable to roll syndicate, will come out onto the salvage bay and begin pilfering the selection. I will normally give them a gruff and stern warning to please cease, and if they need something to simply ask. I understand we can hoard in the salvage bay, be it station power infrastructure (substations, APC electronics, thrusters, etc) that I personally keep either for shittle or in the event cargo shuttle is rendered disabled, medication from the space bear debris, or a myriad of possibly useful items (knives, jetpacks, etc.) Now, the game is touted as a game about paranoia and survival. Recently I almost placed an engineer into critical condition as they stole a salvage suit (extremely high pierce/slash/brute damage resistance as opposed to engineering suit) and refused to drop it. I don't know *who* is a Syndicate, and actively allowing the potential arming of random station crewmates I don't think falls under the job description. My question is - am I able to treat this the same as someone entering my department (chemistry, engineering, etc.) and taking high value items? Is placing someone in critical if they come onto the salvage bay (or worse, a debris) and begin grabbing objects, and are sternly warned, acceptable? It's extremely difficult to get security outside in space, by the time whoever stole the items is gone they're able to use or stash whatever they stole - this ranges from shotguns to lasers to salvage suits, etc.; the most surefire way I have as a salvager is using my knife and proto kinetic accelerator to crit the person, then my welding tool to cauterize the wounds followed by an epen. I don't know if I should inundate the relay with ahelps about petty theft (that can escalate to high value theft easily) which is why I handle things IC/internally. I am guilty of stealing things (usually shuttle board and sometimes insuls from the tech room for salvaging) so I personally believe these can be handled in character, it just so happens that salvagers as characters start with knives and sci fi muskets. I have not been ahelped/bwoinked that I know of for these actions, and I believe they are justified, but I am wondering if there is a guideline for future salvagers who want to feel less helpless or if this discussion has ever been presented.